Bill Kinnon is in New York and attended a service of Redeemer Presbyterian last night, the lucky dog. Hope to get there myself later this year.
I may struggle with this model of church - but let me positively acknowledge that Redeemer exists for the city of New York - with their focus on preaching a holistic gospel that can transform the city. Some of that "preaching" takes place on Sundays. Much of happens in the warp and woof of peoples lives lived out in the city...
Redeemer is in the process of purchasing a parking garage on the Upper West Side that will be converted into a 900 seat auditorium, offices and community space. They eventually hope to have three church facilities in Manhattan.
Bill links to the Vision Campaign website. I thought this 1-minute video was a good contribution to my question from the Viola and Barna book: "Is there a way to use buildings missionally and in a way that expresses the true nature of the church?"
more videos here
Update: Tim Keller comments at Bill's blog:
Bill--So glad you could drop in. I think I know almost exactly how you feel about the consumer/traditional/institutional church. Twenty years ago I started a church out of frustration with the church, but it got big, and that was never my intention or expectation when it started. Size brings a certain amount of institutionalization, unavoidably. But I didn't think I had the right to forcibly keep the ministry very small. It's a trade off, a very hard one. Glad you came by.
It may be getting to the point where you and I need to do a team blog.
'Twas great to be at Redeemer last night. I actually wrote three separate blog posts before I published one. I loved the service, think Tim Keller is the "cat's pajamas" (which is a positive phrase in my neck of the woods) but am concerned with how integral he is to the vision of Redeemer.
You and I had this conversation about a large ministry in our own region built upon the teaching gifts of a particular individual - and I wondered what would happen to the organization if he was sidelined. However, it does look like Tim has surrounded himself with fabulous people - so this may well not be an issue @ Redeemer. I hope not.
Using the Wolfgang Simson language - I would see Tim as an apostle to the churches of New York - and the church plants he's involved with in places like Toronto.
It would be interesting to have someone like Tim respond to Pagan Christianity. I should see whether I can get Alan Roxburgh to read it.
Bill:
I think I may have enticed a church historian of some renown to review PC - hope so! It will be interesting to see what he has to say.
I'm sure that Keller and Redeemer have wrestled through the issue you've raised. I like that they're talking about planting another 500 churches in the next 25 years - no way that can center on one individual. They've already planted over 100 churches worldwide.
Enjoy your time in NYC. Some day I hope to move there for at least a year.