Comments on: Ending the Discussion Before It Starts

By: Darryl

Darryl — Wed, 24 Feb 2010 13:29:19 +0000

Thanks, Mike. I was glad to see that he clarified his intentions.

I’m still not a fan of the book, but I don’t think McLaren was trying to shut down honest critiques of his book, and I appreciate that.

By: Mike Clawson

Mike Clawson — Wed, 24 Feb 2010 05:27:14 +0000

Sorry, I forgot to include the link. You can find Brian’s response here: http://www.brianmclaren.net/archives/blog/a-new-kind-of-christianity-contd.html

By: Mike Clawson

Mike Clawson — Wed, 24 Feb 2010 05:26:28 +0000

You may be interested to know that Brian McLaren has responded to exactly the kind of concerns you raise here. As I suspected, his intent was rather different than what you assumed he was implying.

I guess these sorts of miscommunications are inevitable when one side is insufficiently clear in their writing and the other side is insufficiently charitable in their reading. It’s too bad.

By: Art

Art — Wed, 10 Feb 2010 21:37:12 +0000

I find this discussion “technique” prevalent in too many areas these days:

If you disagree with gay marriage, you must be homophobic.
If you disagree with a black-only school, you must be racist.
If you disagree with the death penalty, you must be anti-Law and Order.
If you don’t think burqas should be worn in public, you must be anti-Islamic.
If you disagree with me you are closed-minded.

Whatever happened to open discussion and tolerance?

By: Bill Kinnon

Bill Kinnon — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 17:52:30 +0000

Darryl,
Good post.

Linda’s point reminds me of Jesus instructions to the disciples in Luke 10, where they are told to receive hospitality (or not) at the tables of those they encounter. They are not told to decide who gets to be invited to their table.

And I think Brad draws an accurate distinction between emergent and missional (rather than emerging, as such).

Ken, you are one of the more gracious Toronto pastors I know. Thank you for the wisdom.

By: brad/futuristguy

brad/futuristguy — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 17:36:50 +0000

Linda … I guess that’s quite *missional* of you, but apparently not so *emerging* for you. I resonate with what you’re saying.

In the bigger picture of things, maybe the framing on Mr. McLaren’s book and invitation helps clarify some differences between the two “conversations” and “movements” known as emerging and missional. And that does seem to be the way this decade is rolling itself out, though perhaps through nothing more than providential conspiracy?

By: Linda

Linda — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 17:13:23 +0000

What I have trouble with is the implied ownership of the table. Rather than demanding that people come to our table on our terms, I would rather see an attitude of meeting others at their table.

By: Ken Davis

Ken Davis — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 14:11:54 +0000

This is an excellent post.
McClaren aside (and that is not that difficult) the point you make about setting the terms of a discussion is an excellent one. It’s a reminder to me that I can do this. If I despise it in McClaren, I need to remember that I can do it too. Even when my view is more orthodox, it does not make it less obnoxious. We all need to learn how to vociferously defend the truth without the obnoxio; without implying that the reason I hold to my position is because I am less depraved than my opponent and without determining all the rules of the game before anyone else shows up tp play.
Thanks for this.

By: Dave

Dave — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 14:02:13 +0000

Why walk on egg shells? Let the Bible set the terms of your criticism in both its manner and content. Boldly go where God would go and say what’s wrong and right. McLaren isn’t worth listening to anymore.

By: Tim Etherington

Tim Etherington — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 13:28:34 +0000

Good night! If you “come to the table” with McLaren and say that some of the old things are right and good, he doesn’t want you there. If you’re willing to come and toss it all, you’re welcomed. He’s already boxed us in to his way or the highway. But he does it with a warm smile and good sounding intentions. Man.